Honda Quitting F1!

[smokie]

Ecclestone knows how to win people over...

"Bernie Ecclestone: Technicians Should Be at Home Playing On Playstations" - http://bleacherreport.com/articles/89405-bernie-ecclestone-technicians-should-be-at-home-playing-on-playstations

[Brad Zarse]

I was finally starting to look forward to an F1 season - last year was good, but anyone with a degree of patriotism would have enjoyed the age old britsh/brazilian battle, and enjoyed seeing Britain finally win it as well!!  The cars for next season sound interesting - slick tyres, wings that allow overtaking etc etc....

But I can't help thinking that now is the time.  The time for the big boys to stage a coup and get Ecclestone and Mosely out of the sport.  Ecclestone to his credit, is a shrewd and influencial individual, and some of the success F1 has enjoyed, is down to him - but it strikes me that he's got to the point where he's got bored, and decided to shuffle his cards.....at which point honda have simply said (in the words of our illustrious  - sort of - chief) "F*** bernie, F*** F1"....

How many teams leaving would it take?  If Toyota , BMW  and Renault pull out (not inconcievable given the economic situation) there's hardly anyone left - Ferrari/Force India, Red Bull/Torro Rosso, Mclaren, Williams - TV Revenues go down, sponsorship goes down - the sport goes back a decade - but is anyone actually trying to convince them to stay?  Is ecclestone using any of his horredous wealth to ensure that F1 doesn't go down the pan?  Is he heck....  Everyone knows in business you make hay whilst the sun is shining, and use the stockpile to fill in the rainy days - so where's the support? 

Myself?  I'll be watching A1GP this year - Ferrari are guaranteed to win that, but at least the racing isn't tainted with the poisoned dwarf type involvement.

My solution?  Ron Dennis has been talking about retirement for a while now - maybe it's time he took Bernies place?  that'll finally put an end to F1 and allow a pheonix to rise from the flames whilst, in my opinion one of the chief contributors to F1's terrible reputation, Ferrari,  would be racing roundy roundy in the states in order to avoid Ron's wrath....... 

[Boorish Grobian]

The sad fact is that F1 right now is a house of cards waiting to collapse.  With declining cars sales how much longer can Renault and BMW continue to justify the expense of F1 programs?  I've heard Renault was going to temporarily close its Le Mans manufacturing facility to cut cost.  Also how much longer can a energy drink maker continue to support two F1 teams?  Best thing that could happen is for the whole damn thing to implode on itself and a group with a new and fresh approach breathe it back to life.  F1's been a laughing joke for quite a while now, but its quickly slipping from the absurd to the ridiculous.
Fax

[Nordic]

Also how much longer can a energy drink maker continue to support two F1 teams?  .
Fax

The owner of red bull was selling Torro Rosso, he has changed his mind now and wants to retain control and berger has gone.

Red Bull seem to be bucking the trend and this guy has very deep pockets, christ knows were all the money comes from, its not just F1 he sponsors.

 I really cant believe its solely from his drinks is it?

[nopanic - neil]

Also how much longer can a energy drink maker continue to support two F1 teams?  .
Fax

The owner of red bull was selling Torro Rosso, he has changed his mind now and wants to retain control and berger has gone.

Red Bull seem to be bucking the trend and this guy has very deep pockets, christ knows were all the money comes from, its not just F1 he sponsors.

 I really cant believe its solely from his drinks is it?

I can,

how much is a can to buy?  and how much to produce?

According to Wiki - they sell 3 billion cans per year!  -  I can hear the cash register ringing now

[smokie]

Apparently the FIA and teams have agreed "cost cutting measures" for 2009, details to be announced on Friday.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/7774277.stm

[smokie]

...and here are said details...

Engines:
- From 2009, engine life to be doubled. Each driver to use maximum of eight engines per season; each team can use an additional four for testing
- Limited to 18,000 revs per minute.
- Cost to independent teams will be approximately 50% of 2008 prices.
- 2010 engine will continue to be used in 2011 and 2012.
Race weekend:
- From 2010, standardised radio and telemetry systems, a ban on tyre warmers, mechanical purging of tyres and refuelling on race weekends.
- Possible reduction in race distance or duration (proposal to follow after market research).
Research:
- No wind tunnel exceeding 60% scale and 50 metres per second to be used after 1 January 2009.
- Restrictions on aerodynamic research, combined with a full analysis of factory facilities.
- Factory closures for six weeks per year, to accord with local laws.
Other:
- From 2010, subject to confirmation of practicability, the same transmission will be used by all teams.
- FIA to compose a standard parts list for the chassis.
- FIA and Formula One Teams' Association to study possibility of an entirely new power train (engine and transmission) for 2013, based on energy efficiency.

[Leftie]

For the new Rules, I would sugest the following;

a.  Bring back 'real' gearboxes. You know, the ones with the gearchange on the right hand side that nicked your knuckles when changing,

b.  Standardised tyres all the same compound:- Wets, Inters, Slicks. No special compounds, so really single manufacturer supply,

c.  No 'refuelling' during the race,

d.  Points for 'pole' and 'fastest lap'.

e.  Standard pump fuel whether Derv or Unleaded.

After all, F1 is a sprint race. Not a series of 2 or 3 races depending on others as has been the case for god knows.......

[Nordic]

WRC has lost two teams. Suzuki yesterday but a bit of a shocker, Subaru has pulled the plug now as well.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/world_rally/7785299.stm

Clearly this leaves Prodrive without a works rally team, bit hopefully Aston will benefit as rumours contine of a works Gulf sponsored P1 team, maybe annouced at the Autosport show.

[Andy Zarse]

WRC has lost two teams. Suzuki yesterday but a bit of a shocker, Subaru has pulled the plug now as well.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/world_rally/7785299.stm

Clearly this leaves Prodrive without a works rally team, bit hopefully Aston will benefit as rumours contine of a works Gulf sponsored P1 team, maybe annouced at the Autosport show.

I can't see the point, unless I'm missing summat, surely petrol regs mean the Aston would not be competitive with oil burners?

Shame about Subaru too, but their sales figures must be appalling given their recent woeful efforts on the latest Impreza.

[Mr Termite]

Other:
- From 2010, subject to confirmation of practicability, the same transmission will be used by all teams.
- FIA to compose a standard parts list for the chassis.
- FIA and Formula One Teams' Association to study possibility of an entirely new power train (engine and transmission) for 2013, based on energy efficiency.

Yeah, right. So, what the F1 pub machine would still have us all believe is the premier motor racing spectacle in the whole world will now have lots of cars painted different colours but identical in many respects under the skin. A one-make series in all but badge. Whether you love Ferrari, McLaren or just Formula 1, this can't be good news for you. On the other hand, step forward Sportscar racing! Now is your hour!

[Doris]

Other:
- From 2010, subject to confirmation of practicability, the same transmission will be used by all teams.
- FIA to compose a standard parts list for the chassis.
- FIA and Formula One Teams' Association to study possibility of an entirely new power train (engine and transmission) for 2013, based on energy efficiency.

Yeah, right. So, what the F1 pub machine would still have us all believe is the premier motor racing spectacle in the whole world will now have lots of cars painted different colours but identical in many respects under the skin. A one-make series in all but badge.

Sounds a lot like A1 GP to me ...

Dx

[Boorish Grobian]

Or Indycar or dare I say it...NASCAR!
These are my sons Walker and Texas Ranger.  And I'd like to give thanks to little eight pound five ounce baby Jesus.
Fax

[mgmark]

Let's go back to back street bodgers (very competent ones) cobbling together a chassis and installing a fire pump engine then.....

MG Mark

[Boorish Grobian]

If someone wants to build a customer engine that anyone can purchase and plug into the back of a F1 car (as in Cosworth DFV in the glory days) more power to them.  Some of the best racing F1 has ever seen was in the Cosworth "kit car" era, when small racing constructors like Williams, Brabham, Tyrrell, McLaren. etc would plug a DFV into the back of a tidy, well designed chassis and regularly beat the likes of Ferrari.
Also the regulation of having to build your own chassis is completely out of touch.  Once again privateers could purchase a McLaren, Lotus or Brabham and go take on the big guns, and win. Privateers who are so integral to the history of the sport, like Rob Walker could never have afforded to build their own cars.  Stirling Moss's two finest wins, at Monaco and the Ring in '61 would never have happened under the current regs.
I'm completely opposed to mandatory spec chassis and engine regaulations however.  As I said, just call it IRL at that point.
Fax