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Author Topic: Hybrid Le Mans Cars  (Read 9901 times)
nopanic - neil
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« on: April 24, 2008, 05:16:00 pm »

Found on the web

Quote
Automobile Club de l'Ouest, the organizer behind the annual 24 Hours of Le Mans event and the Le Mans Series, is currently "studying specific rules for LMP1 which will be equipped with a kinetic energy recovery system."[7]

The hybrid system that will be phased in is known as KERS, which stands for Kinetic Energy Recovery System. KERS does not store as much energy as a traditional hybrid system, but it only weighs 55 pounds and the limited energy storage capacity is well suited for Formula-style racing.

The first of these systems to be revealed was the Flybrid[8] which appeared in an article in Racecar Engineering magazine.

The biggest difference between KERS and a regular battery-electric hybrid is that KERS stores recovered waste energy in a rotating flywheel. Instead of converting waste energy into electricity and than back into useful energy again with an electric motor, KERS simply transfers the kinetic energy to a flywheel in the F1 car’s transmission when the driver presses a “boost” button.

The Flybrid F1 KERS System weighs 24 kg and has an energy capacity of 400 kJ after allowing for internal losses. A maximum power boost of 60 kW (81.6 PS) for 6.67 sec is available. The 20 cm diameter flywheel weighs 5.0 kg and revolves at up to 64,500 rpm. Maximum torque is 18 Nm. The system occupies a volume of 13 liters.

And the FIA

Max Mosley (Wheres that whip Max) of the FIA has announced that all cars will become hybrid by 2013, along with other changes to the vehicles. The governing body of international motor sport, the FIA, has allowed the use of 60 kW "Kinetic Energy Recovery Systems" (KERS), in the regulations for the 2009 Formula One season.[5][6]



Has anybody else heard or know about it?
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Ade
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« Reply #1 on: April 24, 2008, 05:46:00 pm »

Found on the web

Quote
Automobile Club de l'Ouest, the organizer behind the annual 24 Hours of Le Mans event and the Le Mans Series, is currently "studying specific rules for LMP1 which will be equipped with a kinetic energy recovery system."[7]

The hybrid system that will be phased in is known as KERS, which stands for Kinetic Energy Recovery System. KERS does not store as much energy as a traditional hybrid system, but it only weighs 55 pounds and the limited energy storage capacity is well suited for Formula-style racing.

The first of these systems to be revealed was the Flybrid[8] which appeared in an article in Racecar Engineering magazine.

The biggest difference between KERS and a regular battery-electric hybrid is that KERS stores recovered waste energy in a rotating flywheel. Instead of converting waste energy into electricity and than back into useful energy again with an electric motor, KERS simply transfers the kinetic energy to a flywheel in the F1 car’s transmission when the driver presses a “boost” button.

The Flybrid F1 KERS System weighs 24 kg and has an energy capacity of 400 kJ after allowing for internal losses. A maximum power boost of 60 kW (81.6 PS) for 6.67 sec is available. The 20 cm diameter flywheel weighs 5.0 kg and revolves at up to 64,500 rpm. Maximum torque is 18 Nm. The system occupies a volume of 13 liters.

And the FIA

Max Mosley (Wheres that whip Max) of the FIA has announced that all cars will become hybrid by 2013, along with other changes to the vehicles. The governing body of international motor sport, the FIA, has allowed the use of 60 kW "Kinetic Energy Recovery Systems" (KERS), in the regulations for the 2009 Formula One season.[5][6]



Has anybody else heard or know about it?

Only what has been discussed in this thread : http://www.clubarnage.com/forum/index.php?topic=8283.0

Ade
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nopanic - neil
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« Reply #2 on: April 24, 2008, 06:52:54 pm »

Ah thanks,

did not see it before, as away.

Getting drunk on the roadtrip.


I'll more attention next time.
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nickliv
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« Reply #3 on: April 24, 2008, 08:31:37 pm »

Does Biela's inadequately fuelled R8 in '04 count as hybrid?
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lynxd67
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« Reply #4 on: June 30, 2008, 09:04:54 am »

Interesting subject this. I had a friend who has raced at Le Mans 14 times staying here for the race and the subject came up over dinner. He is still involved with testing cars of LMP standard in Japan and he said that one of the major japanese manufacturers is planning to run a hybrid in 2010. I don't think there would be a prize for guessing which one. He raced the LMP1 for them some years back so I would guess his information is pretty accurate.
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nickliv
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« Reply #5 on: July 01, 2008, 11:09:15 am »

Is there a prize for guessing who your friend is?
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BigH
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« Reply #6 on: July 01, 2008, 12:16:12 pm »

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Interesting subject this

Only up to point though lynxy, as far as I'm concerned race cars should run on petrol (the more flammable the better) and make a terrible apocalyptic racket at all speeds. All this alternative fuel business is politically driven misplaced hogwash.

The flywheel one's a good'un though. In my minds eye I can see one of those little toy cars you used to push around the lino when you were a nipper, - next to the little mini driver was a friction driven flywheel (if you were lucky it was also connected up loosely to something that made big sparks and crackled), a few pushes to wind it up to speed would then send it like a homing missile into either the cat or a younger sibling who wasn't yet in full command of their legs and dribbling mechanisms.

In those days I could only dream of a 24kg eight inch flywheel doing 64,500rpm. Maybe in the pit stops the mechanics would have to push it backwards and forwards to wind up the flywheel enough to send it scuttling, in a shower of sparks and cat fur, up the pit lane and back into the race. I'm also intrigued as to what would happen to the flywheel in the event of a large, component creating crash. The little thing would be buzzing and jumping around the track like the Warner Bros Tasmanian Devil, - 64,500 rpm isn't going to go away very quickly, and chasing it with a fire extinguisher and a whistle isn't going to help much. I can see an accident at Indianapolis and the flywheel making back to the pits under it's own steam.

Or perhaps the flywheel would have a gyroscope effect, and the pit straight would be replaced by a very long piece of string and the car could shoot along it on two wheels while the driver licks at a Mivvy and waves to the crowds. I'd pay to see it.

Maybe they should stick to petrol.
H


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« Reply #7 on: July 04, 2008, 12:10:12 am »

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Interesting subject this

In those days I could only dream of a 24kg eight inch flywheel doing 64,500rpm. Maybe in the pit stops the mechanics would have to push it backwards and forwards to wind up the flywheel enough to send it scuttling, in a shower of sparks and cat fur, up the pit lane and back into the race.

Or perhaps the flywheel would have a gyroscope effect, and the pit straight would be replaced by a very long piece of string and the car could shoot along it on two wheels while the driver licks at a Mivvy and waves to the crowds. I'd pay to see it.

Maybe they should stick to petrol.
H

It would need a frigging long bit of string.

or,

I need to check the rules governing the the 'push & pulling' by the pit crews to leave the pits. remember that on the toys, you had to pick it up an do it again to max effect ( oh well, at least the pit lane has a speed limit).
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« Reply #8 on: June 17, 2009, 04:31:45 am »

Very interesting post...  Shocked
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Barry
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« Reply #9 on: June 17, 2009, 12:06:18 pm »

Peugoet wanted to race their hybrid this year, but the ACO said they could only run it as a demonstration, so even if it had won it would not be counted.
Expect to see it in 2010 or 2011 though.
It could all get very confusing, LMP 1 diesel, petrol and hybrid.
Personally I think KERS is a white elephant, which won't be seen next year in F1.

Attached photos of the Pug hybrid was taken at the Silverstone LMS last September.


« Last Edit: June 17, 2009, 12:10:38 pm by Barry » Logged
DelBoy
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« Reply #10 on: June 17, 2009, 12:35:32 pm »

Peugoet wanted to race their hybrid this year, but the ACO said they could only run it as a demonstration, so even if it had won it would not be counted.


I wonder if that's the case, Barry.  Maybe it wasn't entered because it didn't work well-enough rather than the non-classification rule!

Del
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Barry
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« Reply #11 on: June 17, 2009, 04:48:53 pm »

Peugoet wanted to race their hybrid this year, but the ACO said they could only run it as a demonstration, so even if it had won it would not be counted.


I wonder if that's the case, Barry.  Maybe it wasn't entered because it didn't work well-enough rather than the non-classification rule!

Del


Heard that from other sources as well as RLM.
However I suspect that if it was the case, they might have been pleased, as it allowed them to concentrate on winning.
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